Need help and advice please
- Thread starter Jawad646
- Start date
coolraoul
Torque Titan
I would say, don't take a first year, 2003. Not necessarily the FL, but not the early models. Avoid 2003, they are the most likey to have residual troubles.
There was a rework of the interior with increased finition in mid-2004. Not a face-lift, no exterior modifications, no mention of that anywhere. You can see it easily with the plastic base of the front seats, it is much better after the rework, less shiny and more expensive-looking. And some cars before this suffered from a problem at the factory, making the wood panel in the passenger side not matching the wood line in the door, not very elegant. Could be repaired by the dealer.
This reworked model would be a good buy, because they also reworked some electronic functions. But even a not reworked 2004 is good, I only would try to avoid the 2003.
One thing is absolutely imperative: you MUST check the past of the car to see if the recall was applied to it. Do not buy a car that wasn't recalled/no trace of this recall.
This recall was massive. Especially they changed totally the battery-gestion device, the SBC was revised, and a lot of electronic features were updated. Even the wipers were modified! You almost can say that not-recalled W211 are Beta-cars, a bit like fresh-released Microsoft softwares...
It is essential to verify that the recall was applied to that particular car (it can happen that a car is lost by MB, if it is sold and for one or another reason they lost it, especially if it was not serviced by MB).
Another thing, is the service-book; it is very important (also if you want to sell it after). Such expensive car have to be serviced by MB, and all that has to be written in the service-book. It also allow you to verify that the car has the good mileage and was not "miles-lifted"...
So, I would say, a 2004 or better end-2004 model with service-book and recalled, and you have an awesome car. It is, after the recall, extremely reliable, and a very pleasant car.
If you can have a FL it is even better, but it is not really an obligation. But reworked mid/end-2004 would be perfect.
The W211 is, after the recall, a real work of art. Class-leading reliability, a somptuous interior, fabulous comfort without beeing heavy, surprisingly fresh design, lots of elegance, large choice of excellent motors...
Never tried the 320 though, only 320cdi.
There was a rework of the interior with increased finition in mid-2004. Not a face-lift, no exterior modifications, no mention of that anywhere. You can see it easily with the plastic base of the front seats, it is much better after the rework, less shiny and more expensive-looking. And some cars before this suffered from a problem at the factory, making the wood panel in the passenger side not matching the wood line in the door, not very elegant. Could be repaired by the dealer.
This reworked model would be a good buy, because they also reworked some electronic functions. But even a not reworked 2004 is good, I only would try to avoid the 2003.
One thing is absolutely imperative: you MUST check the past of the car to see if the recall was applied to it. Do not buy a car that wasn't recalled/no trace of this recall.
This recall was massive. Especially they changed totally the battery-gestion device, the SBC was revised, and a lot of electronic features were updated. Even the wipers were modified! You almost can say that not-recalled W211 are Beta-cars, a bit like fresh-released Microsoft softwares...
It is essential to verify that the recall was applied to that particular car (it can happen that a car is lost by MB, if it is sold and for one or another reason they lost it, especially if it was not serviced by MB).
Another thing, is the service-book; it is very important (also if you want to sell it after). Such expensive car have to be serviced by MB, and all that has to be written in the service-book. It also allow you to verify that the car has the good mileage and was not "miles-lifted"...
So, I would say, a 2004 or better end-2004 model with service-book and recalled, and you have an awesome car. It is, after the recall, extremely reliable, and a very pleasant car.
If you can have a FL it is even better, but it is not really an obligation. But reworked mid/end-2004 would be perfect.
The W211 is, after the recall, a real work of art. Class-leading reliability, a somptuous interior, fabulous comfort without beeing heavy, surprisingly fresh design, lots of elegance, large choice of excellent motors...
Never tried the 320 though, only 320cdi.
coolraoul
Torque Titan
What, for the rework in 2004? No, not really...Well here is a pic...admire the fabulous Paint work I did
http://imageshack.us
You see it if you compare two cars, one before one after. In fact I saw it when my father was looking to buy one, I noticed a sensible increase in the quality of the plastic material on the seat from one car to another one. The dealer said me some things were modified mid-2004.
You see, where the ambulancy-thing is hidden, where the electrical seat-buttons are placed. The seat has a big plastic surrounding, and this thing looked a bit cheap, you see, a bit shiny and thin.
And mid-2004, don't know exactly when, this was modified, and looked much more upscale. All the dash material was very slightly modified in the same time, and is less shiny, and along with that some electronic features were upgraded or made more reliable.
OOOhhh, got it. There is something with the brakes, too. A function that was added.
Don't know what exactly, mabe the SBC-Hold? when you brake, the car stops, then you press the brakes further and release them, the car holds on untill you press the throttle, very practical.
or maybe the traffic-jam-function; activate it and the car will brake gently when you stop throttling. Imagine a traffic-jam, you don't need to brake: throttle to follow other cars, stop throttling and the car brakes alone, so you don't need to use the brake pedal. But not that smooth imo...
Anyway, you have one or two SBC-features that were added after this rework.
I can't say if the recall added them on older cars too...
However, this is not essential. Take a 2004 model, with recall and service-book. The little rework is better, because of the increaed reliability i think it added to the car.
http://imageshack.us
You see it if you compare two cars, one before one after. In fact I saw it when my father was looking to buy one, I noticed a sensible increase in the quality of the plastic material on the seat from one car to another one. The dealer said me some things were modified mid-2004.
You see, where the ambulancy-thing is hidden, where the electrical seat-buttons are placed. The seat has a big plastic surrounding, and this thing looked a bit cheap, you see, a bit shiny and thin.
And mid-2004, don't know exactly when, this was modified, and looked much more upscale. All the dash material was very slightly modified in the same time, and is less shiny, and along with that some electronic features were upgraded or made more reliable.
OOOhhh, got it. There is something with the brakes, too. A function that was added.
Don't know what exactly, mabe the SBC-Hold? when you brake, the car stops, then you press the brakes further and release them, the car holds on untill you press the throttle, very practical.
or maybe the traffic-jam-function; activate it and the car will brake gently when you stop throttling. Imagine a traffic-jam, you don't need to brake: throttle to follow other cars, stop throttling and the car brakes alone, so you don't need to use the brake pedal. But not that smooth imo...
Anyway, you have one or two SBC-features that were added after this rework.
I can't say if the recall added them on older cars too...
However, this is not essential. Take a 2004 model, with recall and service-book. The little rework is better, because of the increaed reliability i think it added to the car.
coolraoul
Torque Titan
No pics needed here...
The pre-FL models had SBC; the brakes were not directly controlled by hydraulic fluid, but by electronics. This electronic allowed a more precise regulation of the brake force, and the advantage was a really increased efficiency of the ESP, because the brakes were electronically controlled like the ESP. Lots of people say, on the snow for instance, the ESP+SBC is really impressive.
Also it allowed the presaid SBC-Hold, the traffic-jam function; if it rains, the system will apply micro-braking from time to time to keep the brake discs ready, without water on them; if you quickly put your feet off the throttle the system will prepare the brake by puting the pads near the discs...So lots of advanced, more or less useful features thanks to the SBC.
However, some said pedal feeling was a bit strange...this was adressed with the recall.
But in fact, there were some troubles at the beginning, on 2003 models, with ESP lights flashing because SBC malfunction. Of course you still had a mechanical, hydraulic system in case of a problem.
This SBC, after the recall, works perfectly fine.
But
1) it became the flagship, symbol for the electronical malfunctions of earlier W211
2) clients were worried because it is a safety-linked element of tha car
3) it was extremely expensive to produce
4) newer generations of Bosch ESP (8.0 I think) allowed all these functions without SBC, only the impressive cooperation with the ESP was reserved to SBC-brakes.
So MB decided to remove the SBC from the W211, with the FL. it means that FL W211 have conventionnal, hydraulical brakes with no particular electronic control on them, but still all the advanced functions.
Like I said, after the recall SBC became perfectly reliable. No problem with that for me. Even 2003 work very well after the recall, however they are not as troublefree as 2004 and after.
You're right, my advice would be 2004.
The W211 is a fine choice, just make sure you avoid the 2003 models, actually try to get those manufactured after Feb 2005 because the majority of the recalls are for models before that time.
Late 2002 to mid 2003 models have inconsistent interior panel gaps, and some buttons and controls aren't as well built as later models.
The 2004 model year cars received a few improvements. The vents above the middle air con vents are changed, and as Coolraoul has mentioned, the base of the seats are no longer covered with brittle plastic trim. The SBC system received another software update to improve the linearity of the braking force. A bracket to the brake lines are added to prevent them from coming lose. The sat nav system also received a software update.
Mercedes actually remove 2 functions from the SBC system to reduce complexity and improve on reliability. The traffic stop function and the soft stop function is removed. The Brake Hold function is always there from the beginning.
The main issue or worry of the SBC system is that it doesn't have an adquate backup system. Since there isn't a master cylinder, once the electric pump fails, there will be nothing to pressureise the brake fluid in the lines, so when you press the brakes, you only get about 25% of the original braking force at the front wheels, and 0% at the rear. This isn't really a backup system and it is of course very dangerous. I know 2 family friends have suffered from this SBC failure, but they were travelling at slow speed so they didn't crash.
MB switched back to the normal full hydraulic setup with a master cylinder for the FL version.
Other than that, some SBC cars have excessive wear on the rear brakes and pads, some model suffer from poor radio reception, and others have faulty wheel bearing. The dashboard lights can go out, the COMMAND system can overheat, but so far GCF forum members are all happy with their E-class.
Late 2002 to mid 2003 models have inconsistent interior panel gaps, and some buttons and controls aren't as well built as later models.
The 2004 model year cars received a few improvements. The vents above the middle air con vents are changed, and as Coolraoul has mentioned, the base of the seats are no longer covered with brittle plastic trim. The SBC system received another software update to improve the linearity of the braking force. A bracket to the brake lines are added to prevent them from coming lose. The sat nav system also received a software update.
Mercedes actually remove 2 functions from the SBC system to reduce complexity and improve on reliability. The traffic stop function and the soft stop function is removed. The Brake Hold function is always there from the beginning.
The main issue or worry of the SBC system is that it doesn't have an adquate backup system. Since there isn't a master cylinder, once the electric pump fails, there will be nothing to pressureise the brake fluid in the lines, so when you press the brakes, you only get about 25% of the original braking force at the front wheels, and 0% at the rear. This isn't really a backup system and it is of course very dangerous. I know 2 family friends have suffered from this SBC failure, but they were travelling at slow speed so they didn't crash.
MB switched back to the normal full hydraulic setup with a master cylinder for the FL version.
Other than that, some SBC cars have excessive wear on the rear brakes and pads, some model suffer from poor radio reception, and others have faulty wheel bearing. The dashboard lights can go out, the COMMAND system can overheat, but so far GCF forum members are all happy with their E-class.
Merc1
Premium
Pretty much what everyone is saying here. I'd go for a nice 2004 with low miles or a 2005 with low miles and Starmark the hell out of it and be off. I too have thought about a new W211 along with various Audis, VWs and gasp even Acuras. Not sure what I'll do.
The W211 is the best E since the W124, as I really don't like the interior and drive of the W210 models anymore.
M
The W211 is the best E since the W124, as I really don't like the interior and drive of the W210 models anymore.
M
cawimmer430
Piston Pioneer
Most people did an excellent job of telling you what to watch out for etc.
My family has a 2002 Mercedes E320 W211 and although this car comes from the era when the E-Class was pretty unreliable, we have not experienced any electronic glitches with ours. In fact it has been more reliable than my neighbours Toyota Landcruiser!
The engine is still decent. 224-hp and 315 Nm of torque are not underpowered and the smoothness is good and overall refinement is decent. It's also pretty good on gas so don't worry if you're getting the E320, it's not a gas guzzler. I can drive from Munich to Stuttgart on the Autobahns at high speeds with an aggressive driving style and a full fuel tank will be about half full by the time you finish that 320+ km trip, so it's quite economical.
The interior holds up well too. Our car has almost 100,000 km on it and she still feels solid and well-built. It's a great cruising car too for long distances.
If you have any questions, just feel free to ask or private message.
My family has a 2002 Mercedes E320 W211 and although this car comes from the era when the E-Class was pretty unreliable, we have not experienced any electronic glitches with ours. In fact it has been more reliable than my neighbours Toyota Landcruiser!
The engine is still decent. 224-hp and 315 Nm of torque are not underpowered and the smoothness is good and overall refinement is decent. It's also pretty good on gas so don't worry if you're getting the E320, it's not a gas guzzler. I can drive from Munich to Stuttgart on the Autobahns at high speeds with an aggressive driving style and a full fuel tank will be about half full by the time you finish that 320+ km trip, so it's quite economical.
The interior holds up well too. Our car has almost 100,000 km on it and she still feels solid and well-built. It's a great cruising car too for long distances.
If you have any questions, just feel free to ask or private message.
cawimmer430,Merc1,monster and coolraoulThanks all of you for information and advice.I will Keep you informed,also I will put a photos for my new E320.
My E320 1999
For salehttp://www.myup4world.com/images
cawimmer430
Piston Pioneer
GORGEOUS CAR! 
You sure you don't want to keep her? She looks like she has been good to you!
You sure you don't want to keep her? She looks like she has been good to you!
cawimmer430
Piston Pioneer
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