BMW McLaren Supercar

[SKY]

I'd put McLaren engineering up against any German brand.

Well, you better, as it is the only british engineering you can compare to any german brand. RR has german tech, and same for Bentley (and guess what? they are now much better) and I would assume a lot of potential Aston Martin customer will be glad the brand will be using AMG tech in the DB11, intead of their ancient V12s.

I will leave aside Indian-owned brands due to their irrelevance in the performance sector.

 

[martinbo]

Ok folks - let's no longer split hairs about the difference between accidental and incidental.

Regardless of all the detailed goings-on, the McLaren F1 remains an anomaly - a rather remarkable one at that - and despite its existence appears to have no present day bearing on a potential and highly unlikely collaboration between BMW and McLaren.

 

[klier]

Regardless of all the detailed goings-on, the McLaren F1 remains an anomaly - a rather remarkable one at that - and despite its existence appears to have no present day bearing on a potential and highly unlikely collaboration between BMW and McLaren.

That's what you say
The McLaren F1 will never ever be forgotten by the two companies, unlike the half baked 'supercar' SLR McLaren for example. The F1 bonds McLaren and BMW together.

Georg Kacher is highly respected, and knows more than any other journalist regarding German brands.

 

[SKY]

It might be more simple than that and just have the two brands collaborating in the chasis and that´s it. You can have the P16 with a McLaren engine and the M100 with the new 4.0 V8.

What I strongly believe is the fact that M division is pressing hard to get their supercar, and this CEO seems more open about it. Just what BMW needs: more hardcore M2, M4 and M6 with CSL variants and a proper supercar.

 

[klier]

Yes! Do it mr Kruger!

 

[KiwiRob]

Well, you better, as it is the only british engineering you can compare to any german brand. RR has german tech, and same for Bentley (and guess what? they are now much better) and I would assume a lot of potential Aston Martin customer will be glad the brand will be using AMG tech in the DB11, intead of their ancient V12s.

I will leave aside Indian-owned brands due to their irrelevance in the performance sector.

Look at an F1 grid all but three cars are built in the UK, of the 3 remaining 2 are Italian and the other Swiss. Where's the Germans in F1, only branding all the design and engineering is British, as are the majority of F1 component suppliers.

 

[SKY]

Look at an F1 grid all but three cars are built in the UK, of the 3 remaining 2 are Italian and the other Swiss. Where's the Germans in F1, only branding all the design and engineering is British, as are the majority of F1 component suppliers.

Which does not invalidate a word about what I have said about British street cars.

 

[Rolf]

This doesn't make sense at all for them to be partners, Mercedes Benz should have been the partner!

 

[Sunny]

I was hoping you say something like that, Mercedes supply the money but their cars and engines are designed and built in the UK. F1 is a British sport, with mostly British based teams and designers. There are only 3 teams not based in the UK.

But you specifically said German brand -

I'd put McLaren engineering up against any German brand.

I know very well that most F1 teams are based in UK. But the team wouldn't be where it is with out Mercedes behind it.

 

[KiwiRob]

But you specifically said German brand -

You can twist your way out of it all you like, but still doesn't make you right.

I know very well that most F1 teams are based in UK. But the team wouldn't be where it is with out Mercedes behind it.

The team would just have another name, Mercedes are the forth owners, as would the engine builder. Mercedes is the money the talent is British. Mercedes wouldn't be anywhere without the team, I doubt they could do it in house. Being based in Germany is probably part of the reason why Toyota failed, despite having more money then everyone else.

 

[Sunny]

More like the the team would be bankrupt. But then again, to be fair, would be true for most of British auto industry, anything worth owning is owned by someone else.

 

[klier]

Look at an F1 grid all but three cars are built in the UK, of the 3 remaining 2 are Italian and the other Swiss. Where's the Germans in F1, only branding all the design and engineering is British, as are the majority of F1 component suppliers.

Is that why an F1 engine only lasts a race?

 

[KiwiRob]

Which does not invalidate a word about what I have said about British street cars.

Ok so McLaren, JLR, Lotus, Nobel amongst others don't make street cars?You can't opt out JLR as Indian owned, they do make performance cars.

BTW Mercedes is 69% foreign owned. Interesting titbit as of today Norges Bank Investment Management is the second largest shareholder.

 

[KiwiRob]

Is that why an F1 engine only lasts a race?

Each driver get 4 power units per year, you do the math.

More like the the team would be bankrupt. But then again, to be fair, would be true for most of British auto industry, anything worth owning is owned by someone else.

So is Mercedes, only 31% German owned. But then again I'm not hung up on ownership it's where the design and engineering talent come from that counts.

 

[hoffmeister_fan]

I don't think that BMW and McLaren together can recreate what was done twenty-plus years ago. The F1 was one of those "lightning in the bottle" moments. They will be handed an almost impossible task of chasing the shadow of a legend. But there is something to be said of having the bravery to do it.

Truthfully, though, I don't want them to collaborate. I am sure the end product would be great, but I'd rather each brand approach their cars on their own, especially BMW. I truly think if M GmbH was left to their own unfettered devices, we'll get to see something truly special. And what McLaren is doing on their own has been downright impressive and unique to them.

 

[Gianclaudio]

Guys, why are you discussing where the talent comes from, specially with a xenophobic £*#@$! like KiwiRob? There are good engineers everywhere, of course, a retrograde monkey will always think in racial superiority, but in the end, the companies are the one who decide how much resources will go on engineering, development or marketing/vaporware and the result will be obvious for those who care.

 

[SCOTT27]

One thing you have to consider is that both the i3 and i8 has opened up pathways some would deem impossible in the industry. Especially in the creation and manufacturing of CFRP and applying to a car such as the i3 and developing a progressive sports car with the body of a multi-million euro sports car for a fraction of the price.

In these days of rising costs sharing in every way possible whether materials, technology or architectures has become the de facto sign of progression in the industry that everyone is now doing it because it is the sure fire way to reduce costs, expand product lines and increase profits and no one is going to stop.

The benefits for McLaren are similar to Toyota and their collaboration with BMW. The ability to pool resources allows application to be more cost effective as costs are shared. And if we look at one key principal benefit namely BMW producing their own CFRP. Means that sharing with BMW can reduce costs from other suppliers which is what other manufactures are currently resolved to.

 

[SKY]

Ok so McLaren, JLR, Lotus, Nobel amongst others don't make street cars?You can't opt out JLR as Indian owned, they do make performance cars.

BTW Mercedes is 69% foreign owned. Interesting titbit as of today Norges Bank Investment Management is the second largest shareholder.

Yep, the difference is there is no ther car company owning MB. They were not far behind in tech and engines and then were purchased by a foreign car manufacturer. RR, Bentley, AM, JLR... All of them are no longer British owned, and the three most important UK brands are now using german tech. I know it hurts, but it is the truth.

No worries, UK still makes the best suits and hand made shoes. But german cars give them a run.

 

[Sunny]

But then again I'm not hung up on ownership it's where the design and engineering talent come from that counts.

Obviously you are not, cause there is nothing to hang on to. Fact is British auto industry is in tatters. And most of what ever is left worth mentioning is there cause of outside handouts.

 

[KiwiRob]

Yep, the difference is there is no ther car company owning MB. They were not far behind in tech and engines and then were purchased by a foreign car manufacturer. RR, Bentley, AM, JLR... All of them are no longer British owned, and the three most important UK brands are now using german tech. I know it hurts, but it is the truth.

No worries, UK still makes the best suits and hand made shoes. But german cars give them a run.

Which car company owns AM? Several car companies have shareholdings in Daimler AG.